[slicemaster101]

Originally Posted by datarax

Well then I guess you imply BV does not have a reputation for reliability.

Not necessarily according to Broadband reports their reliability rating is close to 80% (which isn't bad considering the highest reliability rating received is 97% with QuantumVoice) and their over all rating is 81% (better then Vonage and only 1% below ATT CallVantage). This is actually the first outage I have ever experienced with them.

Slice

[datarax]

You only signed up with them mid March according to your previous posts. Do you use this for business or just a hobby? If you used it for business like the "business plan implies" you might not be so cheery about Broadvoice. But then i'm confused. Broadvoice says this shouldn't be a relied on service paragraph x section what mberlant?

[datarax]

But, on the other hand, Broadband Reports seems more credible since they DON'T take ads from BV and receive money for saying the things about them they do.

[cayman]

Originally Posted by datarax

Oh, and my service is dead for incoming calls now. BV is a joke and you mberlant are becoming one too!

It must be a phase of the moon or something like that, perhaps something in the water. Michael (mberlant) has been a fantastic source of information and free consulting help here since I joined up back in mid-December. Michael has posted some incredbily valuable information and perspective here and I think almost everyone else here really appreciates his quiet stable and helpful presence. I know I do.

Now in the past couple of days, all of a sudden its like someone cut a hole in the tent and now there's all this USENET-like rabid emotion-laden posting here, several parts of it directed at Michael in a couple of different threads. Amazing.

Hey folks, cut back on the suds, or take your meds, or just think first before you post. This has been a very helpful and supportive little community here. We *really* need to keep that respect for each other here ... please?

If you want to vent, take it someplace else.

- Don

[datarax]

Yes Don I agree we should respect each other at all times. But what you might not realize is the BV has cost some of us a lot of money this week and and with a spotty April performace it peeves us. The last thing someone wants to hear when they have been wronged is that the BV business account is not to be relied on like he said. If he would stick to helping people instead of defending BV for the travesty then it would be much easier to respect him. And I assume you know first hand that he is a volunteer? It's a shame people have to rely on a BB for their first line of support. I guess it is a valuable resource since BV support is non existent. I'm happy you are not bothered by the outages and wish I shared your bliss. I'll make this my last post on the BV forum since I'm cancelling my number tomorrow just as soon as I call my clients with a new number.

[cayman]

Thanks for moving your post here away from my confusion in that other thread. I'm sorry to hear that you've given up on BV. Would it surprise you to learn that I am close to moving away from them as well. I've posted several on-going comparisons between SunRocket and BV during this last period of upheaval, both here and at DSLreports. I have been extremely critical of BV support.

I don't really think that there are any other choices that are better than BV in features and pricing, and not many that could really say that they are better in performance. I'd recommend Michael's well-done VOIP provider comparison here at Voxilla.

I think that you are absolutely wrong about Michael's motivations and intent. I'm not sure what you mean about "volunteer", but for me in the current "me-first" culture, that's a very *good* word. If you're suggesting that he has a hidden agenda, well, I've never seen it here. He just likes BV service, he sells it to his clients, and he/them have been lucky to apparently be asleep in another timezone during several of the recent outages/outrages. Like most of us, he deserves much kinder words.

I think we're on all edge as we all rely upon voice communications and the latest mess-ups with several of the providers have kind of violated our feelings of trust in the technology. I've had family in/out of the hospital the last couple days and it has really kept me on edge, not being certain that they could always reach me when I wasn't there.

I think that every single one of the providers does NOT understand what it feels like to be a customer, a customer who needs to rely upon this technology, a customer who cannot find out if the goddman service is currently up/down or what, a customer who starts to feel like the provider just doesn't care enough to make an effort to keep him even marginally informed. It's the old mushroom analogy and NO ONE likes it.

All the best,
- Don

[life is short!]

[datarax]

Don,

I'm sorry to hear about your family health. I'll pray for you tonight. Life is short and we shouldn't let these things get to us. It's times like you are experiencing that makes us realize what is really important in life.

I just don't like the way he has ran roughshod on people that posted a complaint without laying out every detail of their configuration first. He's not very respectful to those people. I came to this forum looking for information to find out why my BV wasn't working. Naturally, I went to the posts complaining about the service. Every one that I encountered was not treated with respect by him. I should know better than an eye for an eye since I've read the second half of THE BOOK and believe it.

So thanks Don, for a kind cool couple of words to calm me down and let me leave on a positive note. Your problems have put my problems in perspective.

[cayman]

Originally Posted by datarax

I just don't like the way he has ran roughshod on people that posted a complaint without laying out every detail of their configuration first. He's not very respectful to those people.

Thank you very much for the offer of your prayers, but I would respectfully suggest that there are many others around the world who need them much more than we do. Religion hurts as many as it heals, IMO. Please pray for understanding and tolerance in the world. Light a candle for ALL.

I'm sorry but I must continue to take issue with your characterizations of Michael's posts. I think you have completely misread him, and that's sad. Anyway, I'm finished with this thread as well.

Good night - it's been a very long day,
- Don

[datarax]

Yes religion hurts but faith heals!

[mberlant]

datarax,

Don't take my comments as defending BV's recent troubles - they do not. What they do defend is the agreement that each and every one of us has with our own individual service providers.

BroadVoice's Terms of Service are virtually identical to all other service providers. There is not a single service provider who guarantees _any_ level of service - they can't. There is not a single service provider who states that VoIP is reliable enough to replace traditional telephone service - they couldn't if they wanted to, because they don't own the pipe. Every last VoIP provider gives explicit notice that their service must not be used as a lifeline for home or business. They are sold as low cost alternatives for outbound Long Distance and international calls.

No, sir, I was defending against ibcp99's unwarranted and unreasonable attack against a document that he had explicitly agreed to before he was allowed to complete his signup. If ibcp99 had disagreements with BV's ToS he could have (and, in hindsight, should have) declined to complete the transaction. Instead, he clicked "I agree" and proceeded down a path he did not actually agree with.

You hint that you also are on the Business Plus plan, have a toll free number from BV, and have lost money this week due to BV's difficulties. Does the ToS that you agreed to have any words in it that discredit what I have posted here or that promise any level of service or any liability for direct or indirect losses? If so, then I will gladly retract my words and revisit my position vis-a-vis ibcp99's complaint.

BroadVoice does not pay me to defend them, nor to voice an opinion. I do my best to minimize editorial content in my posts and concentrate on the facts. My entire reply to ibcp99 was concentrated on rebuttal of falsehoods and presentation of facts. It was not my intention to defend BroadVoice, which is why I did not mention the underlying problem at all.

Don Cayman states that he is leaning toward SunRocket now. If SunRocket delivers service that satisfies him better than BroadVoice, that's a good thing. Don knows, though, that SunRocket's Terms of Service are pretty much identical to BroadVoice's (and Vonage's and VoiceWing's, etc.), in that they guarantee no level of service and assume no liability for direct or indirect losses.

We are all supposed to enter these agreements with our eyes open. We deem ourselves intelligent enough to understand the limitations of the service as well as the benefits, and to put marketing hype in its place. I would not dream of giving up my traditional home phone, much less my business phone, in favor of VoIP. I take VoIP for what it is - a 95% wonderful / 5% frustrating service that saves me hundreds of dollars each month. That kind of savings makes the 5% frustration tolerable for me.